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As I may or may not have revealed here before, along with SF conventions there's another kind of writer's convention that I have attended on and off in the past: romance writer's. I find the genre fascinating, and believe that understanding how it works is key to acquire a larger segment of women readers, even those who normally wouldn't read romance. The genre itself is huge, with everything from sweet romances all the way to hard-core spousal rape and illicit affairs kind of nasty stuff.

I've just learned that the RWA has defined all epublishing as vanity press and no writer who's book was principally e-published will ever have that book read for the RITA awards. I make fun of Ellora's Cave and ID Publishing, but dammit, they do have editors and they have some standards, and for the RWA to go and tell everyone there that they're cesspits unworthy of the RWA's attention is unfair. I've read print crap that just as godsawful as anything Gaby Reese ever wrote, and for the RWA to just say, "We don't care how established you are, you're a vanity press" is to just stare down the future.

As an aside, while I was reading the RITA guidelines, I saw this:
Best Inspirational Romance

Romantic novels in which one or more characters' religious or spiritual beliefs (in the context of any religion or spiritual belief system) are a major part of their developing relationship, not merely a minor element or subplot. All inspirational books, set in any place or era, shall be eligible for this category. The word count for these novels is a minimum of 40,000 words.

Judging guidelines: In this category, one or more characters' religious or spiritual beliefs (in the context of any religion or spiritual belief system) are blended with and form a significant and substantial part of the love story, and the end of the book is emotionally satisfying.
Does anyone believe that if the characters were Buddhist, for example, that their story would have a snowball in a cyclotron's chance of winning?

Date: 2007-08-28 11:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mouser.livejournal.com
Ah, if I had a small print house, I'd commission you to write such a book JUST to enter it!

I'm assuming they categorize all "print in demand" and anything that doesn't require you make ten thousand in advance whether or not it's likely to sell as "epublishing ".

Date: 2007-08-28 11:22 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] doodlesthegreat.livejournal.com
When I worked at a bookstore many moons ago, I noticed something specific about the average reader of romance novels: They were the most Republican bitches I've ever seen. Beehive hairdos, floral print dresses, John Birch membership cards next to the Visa, etc. If this contest was being held in Sri Lanka, a Buddhist tale might have a good shot. But here in the US? Not a chance in hell.

As for the whole "e-publishing is vanity press" thing, that's a hell of a quality statement to come from an industry which lives on product best described as "Mad Libs with hormones."

Date: 2007-08-28 11:35 pm (UTC)
ext_48519: (Default)
From: [identity profile] alienor77310.livejournal.com
*collapses in giggles* I have a romance writer friend whose next couple of books should totally match that description and absolutely not match the subtext of that same description.

Date: 2007-08-29 12:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valarltd.livejournal.com
Oh my, I could enter Shell-Shocked which documents a lapsed Methodist with PTSD falling for a wheelchair-bound pagan and eventually following the path of Cerunnos himself. Religious beliefs and spirituality are vital to the love story. The ending is very satisfying (weddings always are)

And there's hot gay male sex.

That'd be a different sort!


Date: 2007-08-29 12:54 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
Well, don't you all look foolish. Maybe you ought to make sure you know what you're talking about before you start blogging. I'd be embarrassed if I were you, but .... well, you probably won't be. How sad.

Date: 2007-08-29 01:12 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nbarnes.livejournal.com
I am intrigued by your ideas and wish to hear more.

Date: 2007-08-29 01:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valarltd.livejournal.com
Hi mousey.

This silly thing has gone around EVERY one of my publsihers' lists. It's basically the print houses doing their annual pearl-clutching.

The press statement from the RWA, dated July 25 2007 states, in their definition of a Vanity Publisher:
When a publisher does not pay an advance and does not become involved with marketing and distribution, it is, in reality, acting as nothing more than a consignment dealer for the book. Providing this kind of service requires little or nothing of the publisher, and the responsibility to market the product and drive traffic to single distribution point falls upon the author.

http://www.rwanational.org/cs/breaking_news/board_issues_new_definition_of_vanity_and_subsidy_publishers

As far as I know, no e-publishers pay an advance.

This is just like Horror Writers of America requiring either 5c/word payment or a $2000 advance on the sale. It's an attempt to keep e-presses out of the marketing pool, and then penalize them for not being in it.

Date: 2007-08-29 04:38 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] elfs.livejournal.com
Oh, I dunno. There are a lot of romance readers in Seattle, and not all of them are rightwingers. Although their eyes bug out a bit when they realize that I actually do know what I'm talking about when dealing with the genre.

Date: 2007-08-29 05:04 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] antonia-tiger.livejournal.com
It should worry people that RWA seems unable to distinguish the honest epublishers from the scammers. It's not that requirinf a minimum advance or word-rate is a bad rule in itself but, reading through the language they use, one oif the vanity-press definitions is based on sales being through a publisher-generated website.

Which so totally smacks down epublishers.

It shifts from being a case of a publisher simply being too small a business to a possibly defamatory inclusion of them with the crooks. And the same for self-publishing. They use the phrase "A Subsidy Publisher or Vanity Publisher" and thoroughly muddy the waters.


And that "Inspirational" definition. Let's see: how about a story about a young woman, a novice in a Catholic convent who struggles to live up to expectations, and who is sent back out into the world to act as a coverness/nanny for the children of a widowed naval officer? Of course, who's struggling with her conflicing feels; her apparanet religious vocation and her slowly developing love and affection for the man and his children. Likewise, he must feel trapped by her status, both as his subordinate and her status as a Novice.

It's probably the Catholicism that would kill such a story's chances.

Date: 2007-08-29 05:49 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] antonia-tiger.livejournal.com
There's two different things.

First is the set of rules for deciding if a publisher is eligible for attending their conferences. That has a requirement for paying a minimum advance, seperate from the exclusion of "A Subsidy Publisher or Vanity Publisher". But the definition includes publishers who sell primarily through their own website, or publishers owned by the author(s). (I can see scenarios in which that last would be potentially nasty--look at how and why United Artists was set up.)

Practically, a lot of this is a "too small to bother with" definition, but the website element excludes epublishers regardless of size.

What's worse is that, by putting them in this category, even authors who earn huge amounts of money from ebooks would be excluded from PAN status. There's the same minimum per book, although the $1000 can be earned as royalties. Unless the publisher is "A Subsidy Publisher or Vanity Publisher", when it doesn't matter how much an author earns.

Me, I'm waiting for Nora Roberts to start her own epublishing business, and then watching the heads start exploding.

Date: 2007-08-29 11:50 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mouser.livejournal.com
This is amazing.

I do not think they understand the concepts of...

Okay - my bad. I thought the award was for best WRITING! Actual writing isn't mentioned ANYWHERE!

Date: 2007-08-29 05:32 pm (UTC)
jenk: Faye (librarian)
From: [personal profile] jenk
Nora or Jayne Anne Krentz ... or Harlequin.

One thing with category romances is that they usually have a limited shelf life. Fans of Nora's or Jayne's or Iris Johansen's "vintage" Harlequin / Silhouette / Loveswept et al haunt secondhand bookstores for old non-reprinted books. While it doesn't pay to keep them all in print stock, I bet that Harlequin could do boatloads of business selling print-on-demand to collectors.

Minor example: Kay Hooper's first romance, a 70,000-word Regency, went for $35 & up before it was reprinted. If you could find it. I've been reading Kay since the 80s, so I have books I bought retail that sell for more than I paid. Ditto some of Iris' old books.

Of course, the specialty bookstores that thrive on the current trade would go nuts.

Date: 2007-08-29 06:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] antonia-tiger.livejournal.com
Rhus is interesting. As an SF reader, the big name in ebooks that I know of is Baen. I know Harlequin publishes a lot, but I'd never bothered to consider them from the ebook angle. And the main debate I've been following (led by Charlse Stross) has been about whether or not ebooks will ever take off as they're being sold by other publishers--hardback pricing and loaded with DRM.

Essentially, if you don't have to pay for printing and phyasical distribution, the publisher can make the same amount of money and sell at the price Harlequin does. Well, you need to refigure royalties so that the author gets paid the same.

Anyway, it's good to have another example to bring to the debate. Here (http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2007/08/publishing_experiments.html) is Charlie's most recent blogpost on the ebook business, and I see he's not totally marooned in Japan. Rather than play Chinese whispers, I'll urge you to pass on the info direct.

(And knowing some of the stuff Charlie has written in the past year, it would be sort of interesting to see his take on genre romance Halting State is almost in Eve Dallas territory.)

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