elfs: (Default)
[personal profile] elfs
Okay, I owe you an apology. Two weeks ago I posted an article about in which I compared UK schools' refusal to teach the Holocaust for fear of upsetting Muslims to US schools' refusal to teach evolution for fear of upsetting Christians. As it now turns out, concern about the former may have been completely overblown. It is not a national crisis of teaching in the UK; it seems to have been a few anecdotes, not a reliable survey of course teachings.

Concern about the latter, however, is not. Half of all public schools in this country elide evolutionary biology in their biology courses for the simple reason that the teachers don't want to have to talk to angry parents.

I mention this because today I read from Americans United for Church and State that The Pentagon has agreed to allow fallen Wiccan soldiershave the pentacle on their gravestones. Barry Lynn is sometimes given to hyperbole so his statement that opposition to the recognition of the Wiccan symbol came from Bush personally makes my newly sensitized skepticism meter twitch just a little bit. My suspicion is raised because there are no links off the page to support Lynn's contention.

Date: 2007-04-23 09:34 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] damiana-swan.livejournal.com
From what I've read, the contention is based on (a) Bush's 1999 statement on Good Morning America (I think) that "Witchcraft isn't a real religion", and (b) internal VA emails referring to that statement, brought out as a part of the lawsuits.

In reviewing 30,000 pages of documents from Veterans Affairs, Americans United said it found e-mails and memoranda referring to negative comments that President Bush made about Wicca during a 1999 interview with the ABC program “Good Morning America,” when he was governor of Texas. The interview had to do with a controversy at the time about Wiccan soldiers being allowed to worship at Fort Hood in Texas.

“I don’t think witchcraft is a religion,” Mr. Bush said at the time, according to a transcript. “ I would hope the military officials would take a second look at the decision they made.”

Americans United did not assert that the White House influenced the Veterans Affairs Department. Under the terms of the settlement, Americans United had to return the documents and could not copy them, although the group could make limited comments about their contents, Mr. Katskee said.

Date: 2007-04-23 09:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] damiana-swan.livejournal.com
Apparently Lynn isn't actually contending that the opposition came from Bush personally--he's saying that the VA took Bush's publicly-voiced bias/opinion into account when they were making their decision, which is rather different.

Date: 2007-04-23 09:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mouser.livejournal.com

Americans United’s attorneys uncovered evidence that the VA’s refusal to recognize the Pentacle was motivated by bias toward the Wiccan faith.
President George W. Bush, when he was governor of Texas, had opposed the right of Wiccans to meet at a military base in that state.
Bush’s opinion of Wiccans was taken into consideration when making decisions on whether to approve the Pentacle.


Personally, I read that as someone trying to curry favor, or at least not piss him off, not that he PERSONALLY said anything on this issue. This time at least ([livejournal.com profile] damiana_swan points the the infamous prior statement.)

Date: 2007-04-24 01:11 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] srmalloy.livejournal.com
In at least the case of Sgt. Patrick Stewart, it wasn't the VA that made the decision. From an article about Sgt. Stewart getting his pentacle:
VA officials have reportedly said they were in the process of soliciting input for approving the symbol when Americans United for Separation of Church and State, a Washington-based watchdog group, sued the VA in October to force approval of the symbol's use. But Nevada Gov. Kenny Guinn (R) short-circuited the controversy, getting the state veterans' affairs department to issue Stewart's gravestone with the pentacle. The state agency asserted jurisdiction in the dispute because it, and not the federal agency, maintains the cemetery.

Date: 2007-04-24 01:13 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] zanfur.livejournal.com
+3 points for using the word "elide" in a non-awkward fashion.

Date: 2007-04-24 02:25 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] damiana-swan.livejournal.com
That's correct ... but it was because the federal government was dragging its heels so much, and refusing Sgt. Stewart the same respect they automatically granted to a fallen soldier of any other faith.

According to this article, the length of time it took them to approve it--some 10 years, I believe--was highly unusual.

A Wiccan group first petitioned the VA for approval of the pentacle years ago. Officials at the agency dragged their feet on the request but in the interim approved the symbols of six other religions and belief systems. Among them was a Sikh emblem, which the VA approved in just a few weeks.

BTW, the full official list of approved symbols is here, if you're interested.

VA decision on pentacle

Date: 2007-04-25 04:18 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
Although posting "anonymously" because I don't have an account, I am the Barry Lynn involved with the pentacle quest. Most of your commenters are correct in pointing out that documents that we had to return to the government (and which we were not permitted to copy) were the basis for my claim that VA officials took into account their understanding of the "Commander In Chief's" views on Wicca.

Date: 2007-04-30 07:03 am (UTC)
lovingboth: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lovingboth
Re the UK story: told you.

Date: 2007-04-30 07:06 am (UTC)
lovingboth: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lovingboth
Coo, nothing for the faith that gave the world the idea of one god, the day of judgement, etc etc.

Or is it just that no Zoroastrians join the US military?

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